A Rational Fear

Cup of Strife — Clare Stephens, Georgie Caroll, Brynn O'Brien, Dan Ilic & Lewis Hobba

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🤑 CHIP IN TO OUR PATREON https://www.patreon.com/ARationalFear
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🐬 A Rational Fear is supported in part by Australian Ethical

On the podcast this week we have two hosts from other podcasts that have been nominated for Best Comedy Podcast at the Australian Podcast Awards.

Clare Stephens from Mamamia's Cancelled Podcast and Georgie Carroll from The Swab Podcast .

Also on the podcast this week we're joined by friend of the show Brynn O'Brien from the Australasian Centre for Corporate Responsibility who broke down the epic battle for controll of the AGL board. A move that could see Australia's emissions drop by 10% in the coming years.

We also talk:

⚽️ The Wold Cup in Qatar.
🐦 Elon Musk's ultimatum to his staff.
🐼💖🦘 Albo restoring diplomatic relations with China.
🩸 Victoria Labor's promise for free pads and tampons.

Dan Ilic 0:00
This podcast is supported in part by Australian ethical. Good evening, Lewis.

Lewis Hobba 0:04
Hello Daniel. How are you?

Dan Ilic 0:07
Good now since this since we didn't do a much of a pre show banter, I just needed to make sure you're recording your end.

Lewis Hobba 0:13
Oh, yes, I am recording my Thank you, Dan. Sorry, everyone. I are very patient guests have been waiting awhile. I just forgot. Just forgot that this was on. And do you know what I was doing? I was at an event and I bumped into our friend, everyone's friend, Tom Ballard. And he told us I've got to get to the Comedy Store. I'm like, hey, I'll give you a lift. I've got nothing. And then I was driving him. And there's a there's a soccer game on at the Sydney football stadium. So we got stuck, Punt Road level traffic for like 45 minutes shooting the breeze having a great chinwag. And then I was like, Are you close? I'm like, I am not close.

Dan Ilic 0:56
Well, that is fantastic. We have a football theme show for tonight. Big thank you to Australia fickle who are sponsoring the show. And also congratulations to Carmen champion and Kate millat. From the Patreon who signed up this week, they get a picture of the King each. You may remember last week, I ordered some pictures of the king. Well, congratulations, Calvin and Kate, they go into you also big thanks to Sonya and Patrick who missed out on pictures of the king. But they tried anyway.

Lewis Hobba 1:21
Dan, have the pictures of the King include the Kings hands? I think so. Yeah. Yeah. Have you seen his hands? Oh, yeah, they look like Frank Frankfurt's. Right, they're horrific. And he you know how he keeps getting angry about webapp pens. He can't hold a pen.

Dan Ilic 1:39
Well, you know what? I will, I will send a pen and some Frankfurt's along to Kate the garment as well. So I'm a big thank you, folks on signing up on the Patreon if you want to sign up and support the show, go to patreon.com forward slash irrational fear. This is a content warning for this show. This show will contain a short impression of a powerful authority figure who happens to have a lisp and if you are offended by such content, this one is not for you. Does he have a lisp? He's got a little speech impediment, but Sybil Adeste Yes, that's right. Well, little bit like my spit bill. Like you know who's got a good sibilance he's got good siblings a bomber. I love a bomb of sibilance Yeah, it's different. It's richer. Yep. I'm recording my end of irrational fear on Gadigal land in the nation's sovereignty was never ceded. We need a treaty. Let's start the show.

Unknown Speaker 2:26
A rational fear contains naughty words like bricks, Canberra, fed gum, and section 40 of a rational view recommended listening by immature audience.

Dan Ilic 2:39
Tonight, White Ribbon organizers canceled plans to have 50 Men ride jet skis around Sydney Harbour to raise awareness about violence against women. Instead, they're gonna have a pop poll, and a sad day for food delivery ecosystems as the beloved Deliveroo has gone extinct. Witnesses say the last ever deliver was seen circling around the apartment block looking for an entrance before giving up and after much controversy. Norman Swan has publicly apologized for his terrible pronunciation of COVID-19 It's the 18th of November with more shuffling of chairs and AGL This is irrational fear.

We're gonna rational fear I'm your host former head of risk at FTX crypto exchange Dan Ilic. And this is the podcast that takes the status headlines. It's a little bit of a tickle. Let's meet our fear mongers for tonight both and nominated for the Best Comedy podcast at the Australian Podcast Awards. It's returning friend of the show Adelaide funniest medical professional from the swab podcast. It's nurse Georgie Cairo.

Georgie Carroll 3:48
Sofia Good day Dan Lewis.

Dan Ilic 3:51
You go and now Georgie How are you preparing for the for the for the awards, a winner and award mindset coming up this Monday.

Georgie Carroll 3:58
Might might even start listening to podcasts.

Dan Ilic 4:04
And it's first time fear monger flying solo without her twin sister. It's Mamma Mia is editor in chief and host of the canceled podcast. Claire Stevens welcome Claire.

Clare Stephens 4:13
Hello, will I'll be seeing you at the Podcast Awards. One idea.

Dan Ilic 4:17
Oh, excellent. What do you what are you gonna do to get yourself in a podcast award mindset? what's your what's your game?

Clare Stephens 4:22
So my sister and I have decided we're never going to be invited to any other Australian award show like the low gays or the arias. We're never going to make it to the Emmys or anything like that. So we're treating the Podcast Awards as our logins. So we'll be getting really dressed up we'll be going really, really over the top and just making everybody uncomfortable I think is is where it's at. So

Dan Ilic 4:49
it's a shame you know, Richard, Richard Wilkins won't be there to give everyone cocaine it will be real devastating. And the podcast no podcast is gonna afford cocaine nicely. The only ones that can. Tony and Ryan The other ones that can afford cocaine they just did that million dollar deal with Spotify.

Georgie Carroll 5:03
Well, you know a table though to you then don't you Claire? Yeah. Yeah, I'm not even going I'm gonna be in Adelaide so you are rock on without me. And you know I've written a speech because of winning but

Dan Ilic 5:20
well if you want it to want us to do it for you and pass it on to Luis, he'll read it out for you. And he's the co host of many podcasts and rush to irrational fears is one of them. He's a man that makes money because he is the voice of honey. It is Lewis Hall by welcome Louis.

Lewis Hobba 5:32
Hello Dan. How are you? Oh, it's

Dan Ilic 5:35
so he's such a sexy voice.

Lewis Hobba 5:38
Yeah. Next week I'm going to the Podcast Awards and the arias it's a it's a real awards week for me.

Georgie Carroll 5:46
Music jam Lewis, why?

Lewis Hobba 5:48
I don't know why we're there. Actually. Were just there. Were just there. Carpet meet.

Dan Ilic 5:58
Coming up later, we talked to Brynn O'Brien about how a board shuffle at ato could possibly bring about the most dramatic drop in carbon emissions in Australia's history. But first here is a message from this week's sponsor.

Unknown Speaker 6:12
This Sunday, the entire globe descends on Cata for the event no one will talk about it's the turning a blind eye World Cup

Unknown Speaker 6:22
football players ends up picking a chip Patty CIO for the wildcards alleged Oh J Trump, every game as a loser. There are just lots more losers and football teams play Oh, I've seen jockstraps treated better than the construction workers in Qatar

Unknown Speaker 6:38
32 nations will go head to head and then turn their heads to look the other way.

Unknown Speaker 6:44
And they've completely mistakes. Look at that. The exploitation, the corruption, the discrimination, the total inability to buy a beer.

Unknown Speaker 6:54
Which country will rationalize the cost of kicking around a ball on a field in a country without fields

Unknown Speaker 7:01
I've got to say cats are is hosting the most awful job that I've ever refused to witness and the final score is migrant deaths 6500 versus the world

Unknown Speaker 7:12
now, interest get ready to ignore all of the action further turning a blind eye World Cup or ticket will buy you a whole seat that was installed by someone who died of heat exhaustion.

Dan Ilic 7:25
Thank you for that very classy sponsor there. Yes, the FIFA World Cup in Qatar kicks off this week and much like the living area of Donald Trump Jr's house, there's an elephant in the room. Cat as human rights abuses have well been documented in the lead up to this World Cup and there's you know, heaps of problematic things but the English comedian journalists it has highlighted one of them and is applying pressure in his own unique way. Here is Joe Lysaght. To explain this

Joe Lycett 7:51
is a message to David Beckham. I consider you along with Kim Woodburn and Monty Don to be a gay icon. You're the first premiership footballer to do shoots with gay magazines like attitude to speak openly about your gay fans, and he married a Spice Girl, which is the gayest thing a human being can do. But now it's 2022 and you signed a reported 10 million pound deal with Cata to be their ambassador during the FIFA World Cup. Qatar was voted as one of the worst places in the world to be gay. homosexuality is illegal punishable by imprisonment. And if you're Muslim, possibly even death. You've always talked about the power of football as a force for good, which suggests to me that you've never seen West Brom, but generally I agree. So with that in mind, I'm giving you a choice. If you end your relationship with Cata I'll donate this 10 grand of my own money as a grand for every million euro reportedly getting to charities that support queer people in football. However, if you do not that midday next Sunday, I will throw this money into a shredder just before the opening ceremony of the World Cup and stream it live on a website I've registered called Bendis like beckham.com not just the money, but also your status as a gay icon will be shredded, you'll be forcing me to commit a crime. Although even then I reckon I get off more likely than I would if I got caught whacking off a lad in Doha. The choice is yours. I look forward to hearing from you.

Dan Ilic 9:12
What I love most about that is he is kind of like this gay Bond villain and it's fantastic. Georgie Do you think Joe lice is going to change David Beckham's mind

Brynn O'Brien 9:22
no

Georgie Carroll 9:24
no I mean he has been a good guy icon as as our backup but now he's gonna burn it all know and ease Yeah, I don't know if Marian a Spice Girl is a gay so you can do I think probably Marian one of Backstreet Boys would be that would be for doing like like you know they just put it in the wrong country again like Russia last time wasn't it and that wasn't particularly gay friendly.

Lewis Hobba 9:50
So thinking 2026 North Korean World Cup.

Georgie Carroll 9:56
I know. Backwards, don't ya and then you're like, well, we've only just had our first gay bye I have basketball I like it's sport does have a fairway accom in terms of a in fact my boys I got 16 and 18 year old do a soccer mad and they reckon Gary Lineker said there's two premiership football is going to come out during the World Cup. Oh, about that close. How is it this year and they're only just having that I know we've had one premiership player before haven't we bought,

Clare Stephens 10:27
but it'd be really clever to do it during the World Cup. Like given given where it is. And given the conversation, it'd be such a it really shines a spotlight on it even more than than this video, which a word from

Georgie Carroll 10:41
the World Cup is you can come and wave your rainbow flags, but don't do anything against our culture. So I think COVID out my warrant. Yeah, a bit of jail time. I don't know. I don't know how they're gonna do it.

Lewis Hobba 10:55
It's crazy. It's crazy that like, given faith, his track record over the last like decade, that they managed to find a new way to be terrible. Like, yeah, they were already you're just like, these are the worst people in the world. And and then they're like, Wait, hold our own 120 Olivia, we can be worse, although they're

Georgie Carroll 11:13
holding themselves out as the most progressive of the Arab nations is what they're saying.

Dan Ilic 11:18
Yes, yes. The the Arab nation that has an embassy for the Taliban is the most progressive. All the Arab nations. Yeah.

Clare Stephens 11:28
It's just such a PR does it like you just imagine these people sitting in a room being like wish we have it? Yeah, we'll have it in Qatar. There'll be no issue with that, like, look at their laws. No, no, it'd be absolutely fine.

Dan Ilic 11:38
Not even not even that let's let's look at Do they have any grace in Qatar? No, they don't. We have to we have to be we have to import some grass. We have to build some stadiums.

Clare Stephen 11:47
It also feels a little bit strange to be potentially shredding money during such a horrible time for the economy because it is

Lewis Hobba 11:57
also for him, like 10 million pounds must be nothing for him.

Clare Stephen 12:01
That's what I'm really confused about. Because I saw 10 million and I went mate, you don't need the 10 mil but then I saw 150 million and I was like we all have a price.

Dan Ilic 12:12
Well, Claire, what's the amount of money that you need to you know, to sell out? So

Clare Stephen 12:15
I think about this a lot. Because I'm just like, you know, not a lot and it's really embarrassing. Sometimes I think 100 bucks, and I do something pretty freakin humiliating in terms of my values, or harder No, the thing that annoys me about this is that I'm like the back ends are fine. Like with like, with or without the 10 100 and 50 million. You're very comfortable. I actually get quite stressed when I think about people who have too much money. I think that must be stressful because where is it up?

Georgie Carroll 12:54
I reckon I've got exactly the right amount of money and I'd still do dodgy stuff for $100.

Dan Ilic 13:02
Can I say we always need more money to irrational fear. So, if you want us to do something dodgy with it head to patreon.com forward slash irrational fear and chip in

Lewis Hobba 13:12
on ethical sniper is listening.

Dan Ilic 13:17
If unethical super is listening and they want to you know double the amount of money Australian ethical is giving us let us know.

Lewis Hobba 13:23
I guess the Beckham's do have to find out. Brooklyn's like constant nepotistic failures and his weird photography careers and is like branch into modeling and theater or music or whatever. I'm

Dan Ilic 13:36
glad you brought that up, Louis because that is a whole episode on Claire Stephens podcast canceled. You can listen to it on the Mamma Mia feed. I listened to it this week. I learned all sorts of things about somebody I didn't know that person was Brooklyn Beckham.

Lewis Hobba 13:52
I love it. I am so excited to listen to Lewis he

Dan Ilic 13:55
Lewis. Here's what I learned from Claire's Podcast. I'm gonna mansplain Claire's podcast back. I learned that he he had his own. He wanted to learn how to cook. He doesn't know how to cook. But somehow someone gave him a cooking show. And he has all these chefs that prepare the food for him. And he actually doesn't know anything about cooking any mixed up what butter and cheese was basically the same. And he

Clare Stephens 14:17
gets paid $100,000 In episode to learn how to.

Dan Ilic 14:21
And that is $98,000 more in episode than I've ever been paid to work on TV in my life. Claire,

Lewis Hobba 14:28
I assume you have and I can't wait to hear your thoughts on his book of photography.

Clare Stephens 14:33
I appreciate how he did right in his book of photography. He said he was in Kenya and he took this photo of the elephant and they're hard to capture. And I thought if you are going to be a photographer, it is your job to capture it. But also if you Google elephant, there are some excellent photos that come up Brooklyn that are better than your one. He's not.

Lewis Hobba 14:53
If no one if people listening and they haven't seen it. It's basically just a photo of it's just like a black photo with a vague outline of an elephant and the caption of it is like, elephants can be quite hard to capture and you're like, there is nothing easier in the world to take a photo of than a giant fucking elephant, you absolute idiot.

Clare Stephens 15:13
I actually feel quite sorry for him because once I went really deep, isn't a man with no talent. And that must be so hard. Because you hold the opportunity and no skill

Georgie Carroll 15:25
and impressive data until this week,

Dan Ilic 15:28
I felt really sad listening to the podcast, I was like, Oh, we shouldn't be talking about this guy. We should put this guy in TAFE.

Unknown Speaker 15:35
This is rational fear. All of the photos were taken by Brooklyn himself.

Unknown Speaker 15:41
I started taking some just on my phone. And several photos from the collection have already been released. And yes, I started posting them on Instagram. But a few years later, Penguin came to me. I feel like it turned out pretty well.

Dan Ilic 15:53
You're listening. very rational fear this week. Second fear. Elon Musk is like the dog who caught the self driving car. Now he's got Twitter, can he fix it before it explodes. So far since buying Twitter for $44 billion, just a couple of weeks ago, he said half the workforce that's about 3700 people. He's also fired most of the contractors about 4000 to 5000 contractors who found out over Twitter that they got fired or just couldn't log on to their email address. Now there are so many people who know what kind of company mass has sent this all hands email. This is the email he sent a couple of days ago, said going forward to build a break through Twitter 2.0, and succeed in an increasingly competitive world, we need to be extremely hardcore. This will mean working long hours at high intensity, only exceptional performance will constitute a passing grade. If you think you want to be part of the new Twitter, click on the link below. Anyone who has not done it by 5pm. Tomorrow will receive three months severance, he is trying to get a third of the people to do 100% of the work. Twitter is reportedly losing so many daily users that the new number one social network in Australia on the Australian App Store is myGov. So that's pretty exciting. People love getting messages from the ATO. Hey, Claire, you run a well, you recently took over a major media organization. What did you do when you took over Mamma Mia did your Did you find half the workforce?

Clare Stephens 17:17
I didn't send that email. And the reason I didn't send that email is because I think when you send an email with the subject line, a fork in the road, it scares people for one. And I know that as an individual, I will often see a scary email and then not open it for 48 hours. And I thought if I were one of his employees, then I would have seen that email gone or avoided it. The time I opened it, I would have been made redundant because I did. Man, that's such an odd email to send. Like, it's just he's asking people, I think the scary thing is that he said in it, that it's going to be extremely hard core and that people need to be working long hours at high intensity. So what point is anyone allowed to say, Hey, I'm stressed or I've been working for four days straight? And can I have a break then I'd say that because apparently they agreed to it in this email.

Dan Ilic 18:17
This is a guy who essentially has been hiring people to go through slack and to go through Twitter to see where Twitter employees have been mouthing off against him. This is the free the Free Speech worry about you went bought a social network. And it's basically basically like yelling, I'm gonna get rid of everyone who disagrees with me and this is what he's been doing. It's so It's so wild.

Georgie Carroll 18:37
It'd be that hard working for Twitter anyway, what do you actually do if you work? Words in the in the book, exceptional performance will constitute a passing grade. What one is this man from?

Lewis Hobba 18:51
Like he's got he's gonna

Dan Ilic 18:51
have to fire himself Georgie that means like Nick's comedy festival like you would get fired if chortle didn't give you five stars.

Georgie Carroll 19:00
Okay, even read that. So yeah, it's just absolute horrible, horrible man. I've managed to avoid knowing anything about him until doing this podcast I heard but a little bit. I do not need to be less relevant to me than Santa Claus.

Dan Ilic 19:18
Can I say to everyone listening when I sent GA Dima asked him to do the show GA replied saying I don't actually read the news. I don't know what

Georgie Carroll 19:29
I said and it makes me feel like a useless person. Georgie wanted

Dan Ilic 19:33
to know what streaming service the news was on so she could catch up

Clare Stephen 19:38
he's an interesting guy. He's trying to save the world. I don't know but the Twitter thing is really has really got me off side. Yeah,

Lewis Hobba 19:44
I think I feel like there was a time where I was like, You know what, this is a flawed individual trying to do the best for the world. And I no longer believe that I now I now think this is a complete idiot who has no idea what he's doing. And he's just Mr. Magoo falling from dumping to dumping 1000 Tesla, Scott He called in Australia this week that killing people on the roads. He promised to get to Mars 10 years ago. He's nowhere near it. Nothing he does works. He's an absolute buffoon. He's overconfident. He says he's gonna do stuff. He signs himself up to it. He fucks it up. And then it this guy is an absolute 14 year old fuckwit. And I do not think he is doing anything good for the world. I think he should go and be an ambassador to Qatar. He is He is just, he's he socks. I also tried to talk to him once its Splendor in the Grass and his security blocked me. So I also have a personal vendetta. He was in splendor. Wow, that's awesome when he was when he was bringing that big battery to Adelaide. And, and he was hanging out at spender. And I was like, Oh, I'm gonna go and chat to Elon Musk. And so I walked over, and his security was like, No way. And I Okay, fair enough. And I backed away and then I went to just like take a photo to send like the work group chats were like, hey, Elon Musk's in the VIP bar. And as I held up my phone, their security held up this like, flashy thing. The phone stopped me from taking a photo. Anyway, I was like, oh, man, you know, one Elan Musk won't let anyone talk to him. And I was there with Dylan old car at the time until an old gods like watch this. A deal at all caught went over. And of course security was like, get on in there Dylan. And the deal on a halo masters had the best job ever. You just gotta you fucking future straight of the year, I get it. A three time Australian Wimbledon winner. That's all it takes.

Dan Ilic 21:29
Now, before we get to a third fee. Did you guys see that Alba met with President Z on the sidelines of the G 20. We don't know exactly what happened inside that meeting.

Georgie Carroll 21:37
But that the Italian one.

Dan Ilic 21:40
President G is is the President of China. The Italian one is Anthony Albanese, who also happens to be Australian. So it's pretty confusing. It's very confusing there. Now, we don't know what happened inside that meeting. But it seems that there's been a bit of a dramatic reset between relations between Australia and China, which is pretty remarkable as we heard from Albanese, his post meeting conference. Thank you, everyone. Yes, thank you. Okay, ready, on want to thank President sheet for a productive conversation? Sure, Australia and China have our differences. China has a problem with disappearing protesters. We know exactly where ours are under very strict bowel conditions. China is increasing coal use. We are far more into gas. China's indigenous populations face imprisonment, relocation, theft of their land, reeducation, discrimination, forced labor, and organ harvesting. We don't do the organ harvesting part. But despite our differences, there's something China and Australia can agree. The best way to support work is to help rich people get richer was Robert infrastruc. Thank you. No questions. What about the questions? Oh, look, there's another similarity. I forgot about repressing press freedoms and I forget that we're becoming more and more like you every day. Looks like it's gonna be quite positive. Well done. Well done. Big thanks to Mammoth dominant claw on Discord who wrote that joke? That's one of the perks of being a Patreon member. You get to access the discord and write jokes for the show for free. Well, actually, you pay to write jokes. It's amazing. We like the Elon Musk here so it's a very good system. It's a very good system. This week's third the here's another thing you can remove from the list of things that are Dan Andrews fault, not being able to buy a tampon yes in the latest bid to bolster their already huge lead over the Liberal Party of Victoria. The Labour Party is offering free pads and tampons. If they win the Victorian State election. It's a pretty good policy that's going to leave the Liberal Party wondering how to stop the bleeding of their supporter base. Labour would like to see 1500 pad and tampon dispensing machines installed up to 700 sites including public hospitals, courts, tapes, libraries and train stations. But not when I found some tweets that didn't actually agree with this. This one comes from interest. Celt, have you tested all the tampons available in Australia before issuing those for free? Well, Susan, that's not how you that's not how templates work. You can't really test them all before issuing them doesn't quite work like that. Dan's a busy guy probably hasn't tested it. Then there's this one here. Are they gonna be for all the different genders please, please clarify who they are for? That one comes from someone called jetski bandit. Jetski. Band needs to know or therefore.

Lewis Hobba 24:35
And then his big job at Sydney Harbour for White Ribbon Day was cancelled.

Dan Ilic 24:40
That's right. He's looking for the next gig. Then there's this one here from karma kangaroo which says will you make toilet paper free Dan toilet paper is a necessity and then thank Liz who chimed in saying that toilet paper is free of public toilets. Wow, you one are really I thought that was good.

Georgie Carroll 24:57
As well as not know is that once a month If you were to wait and poo uncontrollably for the whole week, maybe we should get free toilet paper. That's not Yeah, you can't leave the house you'd have to live in your little hot.

Dan Ilic 25:12
If you didn't come a kangaroo doesn't worry. They just put all their stuff in a pouch. We've got a free menstrual cup wherever they go.

Georgie Carroll 25:19
When does it come in the election? Because I reckon I've only got about three eggs left. Why am I bothered? I've got three good eggs and I'm not in Melbourne until March. So what's going

Dan Ilic 25:31
to ship them to Dan Andrews. Then there's finally this bit of insight from a counselor counselor Steve Christo. Right. Free tampons. What's next free penis and extensions.

Georgie Carroll 25:41
Well, I have been extending penises in Melbourne bathrooms for free for quite a while

Clare Stephens 25:57
somebody who doesn't understand how taxpayer dollars work, he doesn't understand how government works. I say fine. You can have your free penis extensions. I'm all good for that. But I love that men got so upset about this and they're like but but what's in it for me? Like can you can you take some of the pads and tampons? I don't know what you'll do with them that you may take them if you wish.

Georgie Carroll 26:22
Well, so many things on their armpits.

Clare Stephen 26:26
There you go. Thank you for that. I'm going to be the worst type of person like on the person that people will fear because I if they become free, I will never buy one again. Every time I go to a public toilet. I will get a huge thing of tampons a huge thing of pads and I will stockpile them in my home.

Dan Ilic 26:44
Maybe they will kind of mitigate that by putting a picture of Dan Andrews on the wrapper, you know instead of trivia that might that might prevent you from know that not

Georgie Carroll 26:51
all tampons are created equal though Claire, like Lucy, these are not going to be quality tampons. It's going to be

Dan Ilic 26:58
is it going to be Victorian government approved tampons?

Lewis Hobba 27:01
There'll be single ply there'll be a bit damp

Clare Stephen 27:04
Georgie you know when you go overseas, you go to like the US and they've got the applicator ones but with the cardboard. They'll be like that. That yeah, like the ones where

Georgie Carroll 27:13
they used to come with a belt. Do you remember them ones that you said no, you're too young for this. But they used to wear a belt and they had a loop on the front and a little loop on the back to tie around your waist. That's what they're gonna be like.

Dan Ilic 27:26
That sounds

Georgie Carroll 27:27
very Melbourne, Melbourne love a bit of retro. Very hipster.

Dan Ilic 27:33
When we come back what Agios bored makeup has to do with saving the planet, you're listening

Unknown Speaker 27:37
to a rational theory.

Dan Ilic 27:41
And this is the part of the podcast where we just talk about how wonderful our sponsor is, which is Australian Ethical Investments, big thank you to them. Not only do they have discerning tastes when it comes to sponsoring comedy podcasts like ours, they also have discerning tastes where they put their money or rather, your money if you invest with them. When it comes to investments, they don't do things like tobacco, weapons, big climate pollutants, human trafficking, they stay away from all of that bad stuff. And they only invest in the good stuff. So you can look your kids in the eye and tell them that because you put your money in strain ethical, you basically made the world a little bit less worse. Yeah, that's that's the idea. We're, you know, we're making the world a little bit less worse or rather, a better world. You know, that's another way to put it short, you know, glass half full if you want a better world, glass, half empty, a little less worse. It's up to you. So big thank you to Australian ethical, find out more go to Australian ethical.com.au. Okay, back to the pod. And we're back this week, the long running battle for the control of AGL has turned to page followers of climate news will remember earlier this year, when Mike cannon Brooks became a majority shareholder in the company and we just 11% of ownership has demanded some changes in leadership. And so a battle for the future of the energy giant ensued, and thus, the future of the largest greenhouse gas emitter in the country is now heading down a different direction while someone who knows a little bit about what went down at AGL over the last few months is friend of the show. Brynn O'Brien from the Australasian center for corporate responsibility. Brian, welcome back to rational fear.

Brynn O'Brien 29:25
Great to be here. What a week.

Dan Ilic 29:27
Oh my god, what a week for you and what a week for people who work in this climate space. Tell us what what happened with this AGL board reshuffle and why does it matter?

Brynn O'Brien 29:37
So AGL went to the AGM the current board which is the kind of backwards thinking part of the board or that's probably unfair, but I'll simplify like that. They went to the board with five directors right and they said well, you know, four of them are up for election. One of them doesn't need to be elected. He's he continues on but for More of them are up for election. And there are 10 board seats at this company. And they didn't, they just didn't put anyone up. So Mike cannon Brooks and his team at Brock ventures saw an opportunity they tried to take over the company a few months ago, they tried twice, the company rejected their takeover bids. And so they put up four directors, which takes us tonight, and then the maximum is 10. And the current board or the pre existing board, sort of they accepted one of them, they said, Okay, there's this one dude, Mark Tweedale, who worked for Tesla with there's an Elan theme here that I'm not going to take his back into, because that would be bad, but that they accepted him. And then the other three directors including Carrie shot, Dr. Kerry shot, who's you know, very well known energy market expert, head of the regulator, etc. They put these other three directors up as well. And Patricia McKenzie, who's the Chair of AGL said not, their experience isn't relevant to us, we're just going to go to a vote with these, you know, five directors that we think are good, and this one other director, and shareholders basically just said, No luck off, we're going to get the other three up to so now. So all of the directors that might kind of Brooks proposed, and they're all independent. So, you know, they're, they're not there to kind of do his bidding, but they are on the record saying that they think the company can transition more rapidly, they all got elected. So the balance of power, if you look at the nine members of that board, now, five of them have really serious energy transition and renewables experience.

Dan Ilic 31:48
That's so incredible, like a few months ago, grok was trying to buy the whole company and then just kind of couldn't, couldn't get past that 11% mark, and then a few months later, all of a sudden owns the company without actually having to, you know, invest all that money. That's such a great own goal by IGN.

Lewis Hobba 32:04
Elon Musk must be sitting there going, Oh, fuck, there was a better way.

Dan Ilic 32:11
When will we see like exponential change in the way AGL operate?

Brynn O'Brien 32:15
Well, look, I think there's, you know, we've got corporations or in Australia, that kind of governs the way that directors have to do their jobs. So now that these four people nominated by Mike and ngrok have been elected, what they need to do is, like, really get their heads into the game. So they need to go and look at all of the company's accounts and books and really look at those opportunities for rapid transition. So I expect they'll there'll be in there doing it, it's kind of awkward, because, you know, the chair and the other directors sort of said, Oh, you don't have anything to offer this board. So there's some interesting boardroom dynamics there. But look, I expect that they'll all get on with the job, they'll just have a look. AGL, just to kind of remind people is 8% of Australia's national emissions, so about 90 million tons of carbon dioxide per year. So it's really, really massive, and just this, you know, I like hats off to the grok team really like that it was a bold thing that they did, there's no script for this, no one's ever done it before. And they had to wear the kind of very real possibility of humiliating defeat, and they and they nailed it. So it's, yeah, super exciting that the new board or the like the full board, as of today has a massive job ahead. And they still have to appoint a CEO. So they've got an interim CEO, who's a bloke who's been with the company for a while, but you know that they have to appoint a new CEO or or appoint him permanently into the role. And I've just got so much working.

Dan Ilic 33:42
And to give you a bit of history, like AGL has been the biggest polluter in Australia for such a long time. But they did have a plan to rapidly transition to renewables in the mid teens, if you like. And that plan was headed up by an American CEO who was running the company at the time. And and then when I announced that plan, Josh Frydenberg, who was the energy minister at the time, said, Oh, no, no, no, we can't have we can't have our biggest coal user no longer use coal, that wouldn't be good for our Liberal Party donors. He then systematically went and bullied all of the board members to encourage them to sack the CEO, and the CEO got bullied out of AGL quit. And then they installed their own friendly CEO to the coal companies. And coal got entrenched for until where we are now this is where we are at the moment. It's, it's so bizarre that the previous coalition is such against this transition, that that they did that in the first place where we

Brynn O'Brien 34:39
are right now, what we're hearing from the company from staff in the company. So this is a massive company. They've got heaps of staff, many of whom want, you know, want to be part of the industry of the future. What we're hearing now and what we heard over the last couple of days is that this is a big relief, that there is a renewal within the company and Today's a real excitement about the transition ahead. And that must be a huge, huge burden lifted from the clever people that work there who want to do the right thing and be part of the transition.

Dan Ilic 35:11
Brian, do they want to sponsor a podcast? I know.

Brynn O'Brien 35:17
I think you know, you might have to shake a tree down.

Lewis Hobba 35:21
I was gonna say really quick bread. I am an ATO customer. I've been meaning to leave for like two years because we'd every time we do this podcast, I leave go like, Fuck, I'm a monster. And I'm an idiot. Does this give me an excuse to not have to make the change?

Brynn O'Brien 35:36
Ah, I'm gonna say yes. You know, the only thing worse than being an AGL customer is being an AGL. shareholder.

Dan Ilic 35:45
I'm, I'm an ideal shareholder, and I bought shares. So I could vote so.

Brynn O'Brien 35:51
Well, look, I've held AGL for a few years. But no, the the the I think for AGL customers purely, you know, to delay the administrative burden of this. Just yeah, give it a year. And look, the company. I think they said they weren't going to put a new climate plan for a vote this time next year. Now they're saying they will. And my, my prediction is that with this new board and a dynamic, qualified CEO that they're trying to lock in place at the moment, will deliver a really exciting transition plan. And that's, you know, again, 8% of Australia's national emissions 90 million tonnes of co2 equivalent per year. It's such a big fry, and well done to everyone who's who's had a

Dan Ilic 36:38
had a crack. That's super exciting and big thanks to anyone who's good at it. AGL shares who voted over the last few weeks on whatever you got to vote on. We had done for rational fear. Thank you to everybody who's joined us for tonight. Brynn O'Brien, Georgia. Carol, Claire Stevens, let's get our plugs underway. Claire, what would you like to plug?

Clare Stephens 36:57
Listen to my podcast canceled? If you don't want to think about anything serious for about 40 minutes. I think it's a really good listen to this podcast and you'll have some knowledge and feel very clever. And then you can listen to canceled and feel like you've learned nothing. So that's really, really good. Not true.

Dan Ilic 37:18
You're a Mariah Carey this week.

Lewis Hobba 37:22
Oh my God. Are you doing Mariah Carey this week?

Clare Stephens 37:24
Yeah, we did Mariah, but we just it's but I mean, it's so hard because she's she's flawless. She's iconic. So it was so hard to find any you know any crimes for her because

Dan Ilic 37:34
she and we should we should be clear for the audience that even though the podcast is called canceled, it's not about Sam Newman or Harvey Weinstein. Like you weren't? You weren't? You weren't find anything about that. That's not Georgia. Kara. What would you like to plug?

Georgie Carroll 37:51
Well, when you listen to Claire's, come over to my podcast, which is a swab, which is just nightshift, Bama from hospital. So if you ever imagine what kind of utter nonsense we talk about at three in the morning when we're high on Haribo and no sleep, and we get really stupid. That is one that no funny so yeah, that's my podcast.

Dan Ilic 38:15
Lewis. How about you got anything to plug?

Lewis Hobba 38:18
I mean, nothing new. You could still go and watch this new television special. It is called Australia's best competition competition. It's really good. It's on I view. It's very funny. It's very silly. And go and watch it. And if you watched it, get a new eye view account and watch it again.

Dan Ilic 38:38
You want to plug anything.

Brynn O'Brien 38:39
I am plugging the First Nations clean energy network, which is first so it's First Nations clean energy.org.au It building capacity for renewable energy with controlling ownership in Aboriginal hands.

Dan Ilic 38:53
Oh, that's awesome. I'm gonna plug. Question everything I'm on on Tuesday on Wednesday. If you're in Sydney on Tuesday, along and come to the taping and laugh at my jokes. Thanks very much. Big thanks to rode mics Australian ethical our Patreon supporters, Carmen cake Sonya and Patrick who joined up this week. The wonderful Rupert Degas who made that extraordinary promo at the start of the show for the Qatari FIFA sketch. Thank you very much. Also, Jacob round on the teppanyaki timeline who cut that sketch. So good. So talented, so lucky to have folks like that. Help us out with the show. If you want to help us out, hit us up on Patreon for slash irrational fear until next week, is always something to be scared of. So yeah,

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